Sith

[bountyhunter9]

Here is the complete list of Sith minis and their accompanying stats from my new custom set, History of Hatred. Feel free to comment on anything you like or dislike, and bring to attention an incomplete or inaccurate ability description, or something that needs a rename, etc.

1. Black Knight
2. Darth Bane, Sith Lord
3. Darth Caedus, Dark Lord of the Sith
4. Fallen Jedi
5. Tavion Axmis, Sith Lord

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1. Black Knight

Cost: 22
Hit Points: 70
Defense: 16
Attack: +10
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Melee Attack
Double Attack
Opportunist

Force Powers:
Force 3
Lightsaber Assault
Lightsaber Riposte
Sith Rage

2. Darth Bane, Sith Lord

Cost: 79
Hit Points: 160
Defense: 21
Attack: +15
Damage: 30

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
Double Attack
Djem So Style Mastery (Whenever this character is hit by a melee attack, make a save of 11. On a success, this character can make an immediate attack with +10 damage against that attacker)
Soresu Style (When hit by an attack from a nonadjacent enemy, this character takes no damage with a save of 11)

Force Powers:
Force 2
Force Renewal 1
Master of the Force 2
Force Lightning 4 (Force 4, replaces attacks; range 6; 50 damage to target. Huge or smaller characters are considered activated this round; save 16)
Lightsaber Defense (Force 1: When hit by an attack, this character takes no damage with a save of 11)
Sith Rage (Force 1: +10 damage on all attacks this turn)
Transfer Essence (Force 1, usable only on this character's turn: Choose 1 living ally. Remove that ally from play and place this character in that ally's space; that ally is defeated)

3. Darth Caedus, Dark Lord of the Sith

Cost: 70
Hit Points: 130
Defense: 21
Attack: +14
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
Triple Attack
Betrayal
Deadly Attack
Lightsaber Duelist (+4 defense when attacked by an adjacent enemy with a Force rating)

Force Powers:
Force 2
Force Renewal 1
Master of the Force 2
Absorb Energy (Force 2: When hit by a nonmelee attack, this character takes no damage with a save of 11. Remove damage from this character equal to the prevented damage)
Aing-Tii Flow-Walking (Force 3: Once per round, after initiative is determined, this character can take an immediate turn. This does not count as activating the character this round)
Whirlwind Attack (Force 1, replaces turn: Attack each adjacent enemy twice)

Commander Effect:
Allies within 6 squares get +4 defense against attacks from nonadjacent enemies.

4. Fallen Jedi

Cost: 21
Hit Points: 50
Defense: 18
Attack: +7
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Melee Attack
Twin Attack

Force Powers:
Force 3
Force Stun
Sith Rage

5. Tavion Axmis, Sith Lord

Cost: 51
Hit Points: 130
Defense: 21
Attack: +15
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique (Counts as Marka Ragnos)
Melee Attack
Triple Attack
Cleave

Force Powers:
Force 2
Force Renewal 1
Force Grip 1
Force Lightning 2
Sith Rage

[Jm419]

Black Knight seems safe enough. Sorta reminds me of Darth Vader, but not really all that much.

Two styles on Bane? That's a little odd. He seems like a combination of Bane and Zannah, more than just Bane.

Ok, since, according to Lucas, Star Wars ended at the Battle of Endor, then Caedus didn't exist. So I'm not going to comment on him...

Lol. Just kidding. He looks pretty balanced right off the bat. Nice work there - do you have anything there in particular that you want me to look at?

You really like Force 3 on your mid-range pieces, don't you? It's good that these are here - the Sith need 'em.

Do we even have a Marka Ragnos to worry about? She seems a few points undercosted.

[bountyhunter9]

Yeah, they're kind of similar. I didn't know whether "Black" was an homage to their armor or their affiliation with the Dark Side, so I kept Dark Armor off them.

He mainly practised Djem So (which is why he has Mastery of that style), but also incorporated elements of Soresu when he needed to go on the defensive. I'm thinking of dropping Lightsaber Defense and upping the HP to 180, though. If I made those changes, do you think I would have to change his cost at all?

Lol. I couldn't think of a good Sith to make stats for that I hadn't made already, so I chose to make a new Caedus. And when I did that I just had to make a new Jaina. Lol. Snowball effect.

Can you think of any abusive combinations with Caedus' CE? I couldn't think of any in the Sith, but there may still be some in the Fringe.

Lol. It fits perfectly, most of the time. Force 1 is for initiates or untrained Force sensitives, Force 2 is for Force users in training or above average Force sensitives without any trainging, Force 3 for average, trained Force users, Force 4 for above-average, trained Force users, and Force 5 for the most powerful Force users (who don't have FR). That's the hierarchy I go with.

I gave her Unique (Counts as Marka Ragnos) for two reasons: one, it clearly recognizes that this incarnation is her possessed by Ragnos, and two, I have made custom stats for Ragnos (RoT, I think), so the two couldn't be played together.

You're probably right; I'm going to increase her cost to 51.

[Jm419]

Too many pieces have Dark Armor in today's game anyway.

Defensive? What? Have you read Rule of Two? He used pure Djem So, at least after the Orbalisk armor was complete.

Eh. I really really dislike everything after the Battle of Endor.

None in particular - but there are so many pieces in Fringe, it's hard to be sure.

That's fair. It also explains why Han Solo has Force 1.

Oh, ok. I just wasn't sure if we got a Marka Ragnos in MotF.

[bountyhunter9]

True, it can be overused.

Yeah, when he had the Orbalisks he was all offense, but this is a version of Bane after the Orbalisks, when he had to fight in a more defensive manner. Here's an excerpt from the Wook:

A master practitioner of Djem So, Darth Bane was a deadly lightsaber duelist. When he had his orbalisk armor, Bane favored a furious, all-offense style, as the orbalisks formed a suit of armor that could repel even blows from a lightsaber. After losing this protection, he adapted, utilizing more defensive moves when dueling. He was very strong physically, and was able to overwhelm most opponents through sheer brute force.[5] He was also skilled at unarmed combat, being an excellent brawler. Even before his formal training by the Brotherhood, Bane was occasionally able to use to Force and receive precognitive visions, especially in fights.[1] He possessed knowledge of Soresu, using it to to deflect blaster bolts and lightsaber strikes, and he trained his apprentice, Darth Zannah to use the style.[5] The Sith Lord was also proficient in the use of Juyo.[12]

While I don't hold this as 100% true, he would have had to have had some knowledge in Soresu to suggest and then train Zannah to use it.

I don't like how it's handled, but it's quite an important time. The pure lack of creativity is really what turns me off from the time frame - the Second Galactic Civil War, another Jedi Purge, the reborn Emperor Palpatine, etc. But there are other things I dislike about Star Wars, heck it can't be perfect. I find some of the characters of the era to be rather unique despite their redundant destinies, Caedus being one of them.

Yeah, that was an interesting move by WotC. They seemed to do if for early versions of non-Force sensitives to show either their use of a lightsaber (like Grievous) or "luck", which is basically defined as the Force (like Han). They seemed to have stopped it recently, however. None of the recent Hans or Grievous' hanve had a Force rating. I find it interesting that they would just stop like that.

We might, as a lot of the set list is as of yet unknown, but it's rather unlikely. Unfortunately.

[Jm419]

I haven't read the latest book in the series - he lost the Orbalisks? Don't spoil it, just tell me if he did or not. As for Soresu being the blaster-deflection form, that's not entirely true. Djem So, Makashi, and even Shii-Cho all had that ability, though perhaps not to the degree that Soresu did. And, it makes sense that he would know Soresu - Zannah had to learn it, lol. Good point there.

Ugh.

I thought it was pretty neat, personally. I liked it, but I suppose it does make sense that they don't have that ability.

When is it due out?

[bountyhunter9]

That's true. I think all forms (though some, like Makashi and Joyu) were relatively good at blocking blasters. But the only SWM LS styles that help this are Soresu and Shii-Cho, and Bane only used Soresu. Suposedly.

Yeah, he did lose the orbalisks. I haven't read any of the books yet, so I don't really know anything more than you do.

Lol. Pretend it's a Darth Sidious for a moment (man, without the flow-walking it COULD be a Darth Sidious with a simple name change). Can you think of any abusive combos with the CE?

I didn't mind it, and it made sense for Grievous to be subject to LS Duelist and, to a lesser extent, Jedi Hunter, but it could be awkward to have Han subject to JH when he is about as far from a Jedi as they come.

Some time in April; the 6th, if I remember correctly.

[Jm419]

Sure he did. Djem So just makes far more sense - why would you learn a completely defense form just to block blasters? That doesn't make sense...Bane would have just learned how to use Djem So to do it.

Huh. I wonder how...I'll have to wait for it to come out in paperback, because I'm not willing to drop 30 bucks for a hardcover one.

Hey, who says Palps couldn't Flow-Walk? Uh, there aren't any in Sith - unless you're worried about Malak, which is a +4/+4 bonus. Imperials (if there's some ability that could pull this guy into Imperial squads) would be a problem, with DVIC, (which looks like a Roman numeral) and Palps on Throne.

True. That was a little odd...it made sense on Leia, though. I think they intended that FP to be used for a reroll.

April 6. Huh. Might have to check it out.

[bountyhunter9]

Yeah. Didn't he used Soresu at one point in his battle with Kas'im? I think I remember reading that somewhere. That duel might be the source the Wook used.

Yeah. I look forward to reading them sometime; I here they're very good.

Lol. That would be an interesting combination with Malak. Darth Sion could have a 21 defense against nonadjacents and Force users with a +15 attack. Combined with HoloSid, that would make for an interesting squad.

I don't think there's any way for him to be pulled into an Imperial squad, but I don't think his CE would stack with DV, IC's CE anyway.

Oh yeah, Leia turned out to be Force sensitive (and a Skywalker at that!) so it made a lot of sense.

Yeah. I can't wait for it.

[Jm419]

Maybe. Idk. Those books have dubious canon...they claim Bane is the Sith'ari, which is wrong. Based on what the KotOR games came up with - where it was postulated that Revan was the Sith'ari, and was the first appearance of the term - game developers actually told us that Vader was the intended Sith'ari. Then they decided Bane was cooler, or something, and made him the Sith'ari, which actually weakens all of Star Wars as a whole.

Yeah, pretty enjoyable.

LOL. Good thing we can't legally do that, huh?

Right. That's probably the reason behind Leia's FP...but Han's doesn't make much sense.

Me either.

[bountyhunter9]

Yeah, the Sith'ari is a pretty loose term now...Bane is pretty cool, but he didn't do much other than kill everyone. Which is why Sidious is better.

Yeah, but that would be your entire 200 point squad. It would be fun, though.

Yeah, it doesn't. It does make for an interesting skirmish when you have to decide to use that one FP or not, though.

Some of the stats have been spoiled (if you haven't noticed), but nothing interesting has been leaked so far. Lord Hoth, Freedon Nadd, and Master Windu aren't known yet.

[Jm419]

As is Revan, Vader, even Malak and Maul. At least they were cool.

Lol. What about a 500 point squad?

Right. Rerolls are all she can really do, or moving those extra squares.

Ooh. Lord Hoth? Freedon Nadd? I might have to start collecting these ancient Sith. Do we know the whole Setlist?

[bountyhunter9]

Yeah, the Sith are cool. Bane's kind of different from the rest, he's not stealthy or patient or cunning or tactical. He's just brute force.

Lol. The Sith are great in 500 point games. Revan becomes a force at the higher point levels.

Yeah. It provides a great deal of tactical options.

Yeah. Cay Qel-Droma is in there too. There's only 5 OR and 1 Sith piece, and then the rest are mostly Republic and Rebel (and obviously Fringe). The set list is spoiled, yeah. You can see the set list and spoiled stats here:

www.bloomilk.com/Forums/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=5778

Oh, and on a random sub-note, I had a dream that Freedon Nadd had 500 HP. Lol.

[Jm419]

Which makes him more one dimensional than the other characters. Revan's good at everything.

In 500 point games, overcosting becomes less of an issue, because you're wasting a smaller percentage of your points on overcosting. I really like playing Revan and Malak, DlotS together.

Basically.

Huh. That's interesting. Hoth could be a very cool figurine. Now we just need a light-side Revan.

Really? Fail.

[bountyhunter9]

Yeah. A lot of the Sith are good at something in addition to combat, where all of them basically own. Some of the most powerful Sith are better at many things, the most noteworthy being Sidious and Revan.

Yeah. Their CEs kind of conflict, but Revan is really good at 500. Malak DLotS is great at all levels. If only the Sith had some good mid-costed beats (like JWMs and Stormtroopers), tempo control, and a fig to give allies Evade, they'd be one of the top factions. Too bad they can't get all that in the one piece they have in the last set.

Yeah. The KotOR set pissed me off because both the protagonist from the KotOR video games were missing. I can understand including some of the characters from the comics (which I never got in to), like Jarael...but why are there a half dozen Republic Gungans in a set supposedly focused around Knights of the OLD Republic? And then most of the OR and Sith characters weren't as good as they should have been (well mostly OR, but Malak is good).